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TimD

Standalone Help! DTA

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FInally, finally got my DTA ECU wired in. I was sent a base map for a Starlet, but have so far struggled to get the car to start. I am definitely getting fuel (too much I suspect), I've checked each coil and can confirm I'm getting spark. I have yet to check when exactly the spark event is happening, but wondered if anyone can help.

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I'm using stock triggering and engine position sensors in the distributor. Here's a scope of that:

QNaQ57Z.jpg

Here are the settings that were in the basemap for crank and cam

KQsWXcO.png

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I'm very new to this, but keen to learn. If anyone can offer advice, help me measure the above values to validate them, etc that would be great.

Here's a video of the car cranking with some values, the triggering is working to an extent because I'm getting RPM. A friend has questioned the amount of fuel it's getting on crank 40ms, so I'll try bringing that down a little.

 

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A good few years ago I had a dta s80 on my 5e. at the time it wouldn't work with the stock Toyota trigger system and I had to have a trigger wheel fitted to the crank pulley and run a crank sensor. Have they made changes to the software to allow it to run with the stock triggering system?

No way would I run a dta ecu again wished I never bothered with it.

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Yes, standard triggering should work, or so I'm told.

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2 hours ago, TimD said:

Yes, standard triggering should work, or so I'm told.

Have you set the base ignition timing with a timing light? If not I would do that first to ensure its firing the correct cylinders at the right time

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What injectors are you running? 

The 40ms, is that from your main fuel table or a preliminary or cranking multiplier taking you up to that?

Also you’re battery voltage is very low during cranking? 7-8v?

My Pectel will go into a failed state at 7v and will need to be power cycled so check that too. 

What distrubutor pin/signal have you used for crank? 

What distributor signal have you used for your sync/cam?

 

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Your teeth count should be 24 not 12 - well unless the dizzy has been mucked with

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18 minutes ago, Stu said:

Your teeth count should be 24 not 12 - well unless the dizzy has been mucked with

On a Link you can do it this way as you then set the sensor location as cam, which then halves it to get crank teeth.

On DTA it doesn’t look like you can do this so setting it at 12 is correct. You set how many teeth it hypothetically sees for 1 rotation on the crank which is 12. I have to do the same if running the dizzy still.

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You never used to be able to run the stock trigger setup on a DTA that's why I ended up using  a crank sensor, trigger wheel and Vauxhall coil pack. Same with the 3sgte I believe.

 

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Thanks for the responses so far.

Triggering is fine, as Rob explained.

Trying to do simple things first, so I've taken a bunch of fuel out of the map and tried, but the battery seems to fighting a losing battle. Whacked it on charge and will try again.

Failing that, it'll be looking at crank/cam angles and timing.

The car has stood for 18 months, but before then it was running fine on standard management.

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Whats your cranking multipliers and preliminary injection set at, as well as your main table when it exits crank speed?

Whilst too much fuel won’t help they are happier starting on too much than too little. 40ms on big injectors will be too much however if that’s the main table, but as a preliminary injection in cold weather with stock injectors it’s not unbelievable. 

I’d put your main fuel table at around 3ms if on stock injector, my cranking multiplier on average varies depending on cycle count but try it around 2-3. 

Preliminary injection a 0 degrees temp is 20ms, at 10 degrees temp it’s 15ms.

Try figures around that, but yes double and triple check the triggering settings and get that battery voltage fixed as I know with my ecu it wouldn’t have a hope in starting at 7/8v.

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Battery is the first thing to sort, without it we're pissing in the wind.

40ms is the maximum time that DTA can handle. I brought that down to 20ms last night by adjusting the start map, but the battery was the biggest factor last night, I'm sure of that.

Here's the fuel map, now don't shoot the messenger, this what was found on the base map. Which for what it's worth was for a 4efe which had a 4efte distributor fitted to it for the triggering.

fpdDLqr.png

You can see from the video it's using Row 1, Column 10 when cranking, so 11.26ms of injector before any compensations have been applied to it for water/air temps. The injectors are standard things from what I can tell, so 295cc?

I'm not even getting a splutter from it at the moment, but like I say, I'm trying to keep things simple and solve one thing at a time, the biggest issue right now is the lack of battery voltage when cranking.

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Scaling on the fuel table looks a little strange as it maxes at 130kpa i.e 0,3 bar gauge...But yes sort the battery voltage first and report back :)

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Map is from a n/a 4efe with 4efte distributor, hence the scaling.

Scaling shouldn't be the difference between it firing or not, so I'll likely leave that to the person who maps it. I just want to get the car started and be driveable enough to get it on and off a trailer. :)

Edited by TimD

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Yup correct as it’s reading correct I.e 98 kpa at atmosphere, just an observation :)

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Appreciate it.

Not sure what size injectors come with the stock 4efe, could be why it needed so much fuel when cold. Either that, or it's from a warm environment and it never had to start in the cold, I did choose the wrong time of year to be doing this, didn't I, ha!

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2 hours ago, TimD said:

Appreciate it.

Not sure what size injectors come with the stock 4efe, could be why it needed so much fuel when cold. Either that, or it's from a warm environment and it never had to start in the cold, I did choose the wrong time of year to be doing this, didn't I, ha!

195cc from memory, corrola 4efe were around 225cc and Glanza 295cc.

Its all fun and games - im sure you'll get there, let us know how you get on with the battery voltage.

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