maddox710 Posted August 11, 2015 Share Posted August 11, 2015 Every other Japanese car on the planet has an aftermarket item for such issue so where's the starlets? ?As being such an important handling modifications has anyone addressed it with making there own ? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Broony Posted August 11, 2015 Share Posted August 11, 2015 interesting idea, custom ball joints or spacer/ adaptor to lower the lower arm position. would you also need to look at track rod ends?? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
maddox710 Posted August 11, 2015 Author Share Posted August 11, 2015 Same again really dude track rod ends would need lengthening and spacing a little Quote Link to post Share on other sites
maddox710 Posted August 11, 2015 Author Share Posted August 11, 2015 Just waiting for jezza and to get his act together and put something together for us. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Broony Posted August 11, 2015 Share Posted August 11, 2015 (edited) hmm had a thought. could you remove the studs from the ball joint put a spacer between the arm and ball joint? Secure with nut + bolt and longer threaded bolt for the third? Just not sure if it would put too much directional stress on it. Edited August 11, 2015 by Broony Quote Link to post Share on other sites
maddox710 Posted August 11, 2015 Author Share Posted August 11, 2015 Yeah the spacer would need a proper design I wouldn't wanna risk just washer like spacing Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Broony Posted August 11, 2015 Share Posted August 11, 2015 Yeah the spacer would need a proper design I wouldn't wanna risk just washer like spacing Yeah it would have to be cnc machined, but you could use washer to get the desired gap then get the measurement to a engineering firm who could make you some. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AdamB Posted August 11, 2015 Share Posted August 11, 2015 (edited) Do you understand what bump steer is?Do you understand what the roll centre of a chassis is? Bump steer is a relatively easy one, invert the track rod ends (but only when the vehicle is on lowered suspension). You may not realise it, but even something simple like changing the offset of your wheels will affect the roll centre as it will move the tyre contact patch further or towards the centre of the car, therefore changing the roll centre. Same goes for tyre widths. Starlet's have been around a very long time now, I'm sure if these problems were such an issue, some of the big names like Jam, Cruise, Zep etc etc would have manufactured something to help reduce the negative effects. The only reason why other car manufacturers have such devices is more purely down to components being at abnormal angles and therefore being put through excessive stresses which may cause the component to prematurely wear or worse still fail dramatically. Edited August 11, 2015 by AdamB Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Socks Posted August 12, 2015 Share Posted August 12, 2015 Something I have in development boys. Stay tuned This is something I see on the jdm auctions a lot! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
maddox710 Posted August 12, 2015 Author Share Posted August 12, 2015 Do you understand what bump steer is?Do you understand what the roll centre of a chassis is? Bump steer is a relatively easy one, invert the track rod ends (but only when the vehicle is on lowered suspension). You may not realise it, but even something simple like changing the offset of your wheels will affect the roll centre as it will move the tyre contact patch further or towards the centre of the car, therefore changing the roll centre. Same goes for tyre widths. Starlet's have been around a very long time now, I'm sure if these problems were such an issue, some of the big names like Jam, Cruise, Zep etc etc would have manufactured something to help reduce the negative effects. The only reason why other car manufacturers have such devices is more purely down to components being at abnormal angles and therefore being put through excessive stresses which may cause the component to prematurely wear or worse still fail dramatically.Yes I do understand Adam. I have done alot of my own research into this.I have seen a lot of bits over on jdm auction sites but with all the passing about with registering onto site and paying import tax etc etc Just makes me wonder why people have out an out track starlet but yet spec list doesn't reach to these items and setups Quote Link to post Share on other sites
karl. Posted August 12, 2015 Share Posted August 12, 2015 Something I have in development boys. Stay tuned This is something I see on the jdm auctions a lot! Roll centre adjusters? I've always wanted to try them but I cant justify the money they are asking for them Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AdamB Posted August 12, 2015 Share Posted August 12, 2015 Yes I do understand Adam. I have done alot of my own research into this.I have seen a lot of bits over on jdm auction sites but with all the passing about with registering onto site and paying import tax etc etcJust makes me wonder why people have out an out track starlet but yet spec list doesn't reach to these items and setups So you saying that there are these parts available for Starlets, but only on Japanese auction sites? Or you refering to other cars that have these parts listed? I never found bump steer to be too much of an issue, not compared to some cars I've driven anyway that constantly require steering input. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
maddox710 Posted August 12, 2015 Author Share Posted August 12, 2015 Yes there are parts avaliable for our car over in Japan. But nothing over here. And everything else has loads of parts available in this country Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AdamB Posted August 12, 2015 Share Posted August 12, 2015 You got any links mate? Be interesting to see. Are they JDM branded like Cusco etc? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
maddox710 Posted August 12, 2015 Author Share Posted August 12, 2015 25mm http://page13.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/r12776271730mmhttp://page2.auctions.yahoo.co.jp/jp/auction/b171654698They work out to be 66 quid but plus the shipping and import tax it's not worth it Quote Link to post Share on other sites
morgey Posted August 12, 2015 Share Posted August 12, 2015 Fucking ell i could knock a set of them up in 20 mins. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AdamB Posted August 12, 2015 Share Posted August 12, 2015 (edited) The principle is there, but it is very DIY, and with cars being at different ride heights, different tyres etc means they would need to be different sized spacers, and without a kinematic diagram like this: It's never going to be accurate, and certainly not a one size fits all approach. Edited August 12, 2015 by AdamB Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Broony Posted August 12, 2015 Share Posted August 12, 2015 The principle is there, but it is very DIY, and with cars being at different ride heights, different tyres etc means they would need to be different sized spacers, and without a kinematic diagram like this: It's never going to be accurate, and certainly not a one size fits all approach. Adam is right its not just a case of one size fits all. they would have to be adjustable to be universal Quote Link to post Share on other sites
morgey Posted August 12, 2015 Share Posted August 12, 2015 Adjustable isn't going to happen. I've never seen an adjustable set for sale for any normal car.If you were serious about your handling surely you'd lower it to an acceptable amount then correct the roll center with a fixed RCA, then tweak with other adjustments. The only way i could see an adjustable RCA being made is with a ball joint with a long thread, then a chamfered nut under the hub and a lock nut on top. Youd just completely do away with the taper fitting.The problem you then have is fowling on the CV joint Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Socks Posted August 12, 2015 Share Posted August 12, 2015 Adjustable isn't going to happen. Iv never seen an adjustable set for sale for any normal car. If you were serious about your handling surely you'd lower it to an acceptable amount then correct the roll center with a fixed RCA, then tweak with other adjustments. The only way i could see an adjustable RCA being made is with a ball joint with a long thread, then a chamfered nut under the hub and a lock nut on top. Youd just completely do away with the taper fitting. The problem you then have is fowling on the CV joint My Design is adjustable Quote Link to post Share on other sites
MustakimQZ Posted August 15, 2015 Share Posted August 15, 2015 Been looking for this. Awesome work and keep us posted. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Amjad Posted May 26, 2017 Share Posted May 26, 2017 (edited) So I'm guessing noone ever went ahead with this? Nice write up here by Nige (of Pinderwagen) about RCA http://pinderwagen.com/build-topics/roll-centre-correction/ Edited May 26, 2017 by Amjad Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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