huwr Posted June 7, 2008 Share Posted June 7, 2008 Does anyone know if an uprated fuel pump is needed to run a pre programmed ecu such as the JAM, SARD etc or will they work best with the stock set up? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
keirz Posted June 7, 2008 Share Posted June 7, 2008 will work with the stock one mate. the standared fuel pump is way up for the job so im lead to believe.im running jam ecu on stock pump and injectors. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
huwr Posted June 7, 2008 Author Share Posted June 7, 2008 will work with the stock one mate. the standared fuel pump is way up for the job so im lead to believe.im running jam ecu on stock pump and injectors.OK, if I did fit an aftermarket pump would there be any danger of over fueling or does the ecu work out what is going on? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ecksjay Posted June 8, 2008 Share Posted June 8, 2008 um, you sure jay?the ecu/injectors will fuel as much as they need, the fuel pump is rarely the limiting factor.plus the system will flow whatever fuel it needs to, the pump (if you went for someting stupidly oversized like a 255lph) will not be PERMANENTLY running at that capacity, its just what its capable of. it does vary somewhat and supply whats needed, they dont run full whack 24/7 it shouldn't overfuel with just a larger pump, however it would do if you were to fit larger injectors (if it ran at all). Quote Link to post Share on other sites
StarletRick Posted June 8, 2008 Share Posted June 8, 2008 i doubt itll confuse the ecu, the injectors only open the injectors for a set amount of time and the fuel pressure is what causes more fuel. if the fuel pressure reg is working properly it wont affect presure. mine still runs 33 on idle even after ive uprated the fuel pump. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
StarletRick Posted June 8, 2008 Share Posted June 8, 2008 interesting.... i dont see how that would make a difference. as the pump could flow 50000 litres and as long as the fuel reg is up to it, it should be able to cope with the pressures. maybe they are saying that if using a stock FPR, as it may not be up to the task of diverting all that extra fuel, and raising the rail pressure.. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
StarletRick Posted June 8, 2008 Share Posted June 8, 2008 that probably true, but thatll be to do with the inadequate stock fuel pressure reg more than the pump. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ecksjay Posted June 8, 2008 Share Posted June 8, 2008 You say that jay, however, you wont have come across EVERY different map on the aftermarket ecu's.I know this because the Blitz Access i had on my car, however ran fine, did not provide much in the way of an additional kick, just a little more aggression.The car it went on after mine was pretty much the same, except a larger fuel pump and an open filter. the difference on that thing was incredible, actually felt like a different car. The only thing we could assume it being down to was the fuel pump, who knows though, noone could ever know what the map was so its really just hit or miss.However, i believe you worded it wrong in your initial post. It doesn't matter what pump is on there, it'll only ever fuel to what the injectors will allow. If it flows too much, then it'll use the return line back to the tank anyway, so you aren't gonna run into any problems like hoses bursting off Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ecksjay Posted June 9, 2008 Share Posted June 9, 2008 It'll make a difference, but it wont technically force the ecu into overfuelling. I've seen the flow rates for various pumps, they won't run full chatt all the time, thats an understanding which cannot be confused or incorrect. Thats how it is, and what we are saying.You initial post insinuated they cannot be controlled and when install, will flow (for example) 255lph 24/7, which obviously isn't the case.If its a starlet, then a 255lph pump really isn't needed. Tbh, if you 'need' more flow than the stock pump will allow, then at the end of the day, something like a stock 2JZ supra or skyline pump will do the job. The japs usually use 2jz supra pumps, and thats what the modified ecu's allow for most of the time, which obviously flow less than the walbro's but more than enough for most people's requirements.Running a completely stock engine, stock everything, but with a larger fuel pump, you literally wouldn't notice it there. It'll run as it did with the stock pump, stock injectors etc. Its when you begin messing around with ecu's that the confusions arise, especially with these aftermarket ecu's as here's no way to know what they were mapped for. Its confusion more than anything, all we're saying is that a pump alone won't make it overfuel, thats what the return line is for after all. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dave-gtturbo Posted June 9, 2008 Share Posted June 9, 2008 My understanding of the fuel pump is that an uprated one will just keep the fuel return line more busy if its been the only change...Also, It would depend what the ECU was mapped for surely, as I've the aftermarket ECU's aren't and 'Off the shelf' units. Either way, I'd stick with what they recommend, personally. Plus, if it isn't needed, why bother uprating it?Dave Quote Link to post Share on other sites
dave-gtturbo Posted June 9, 2008 Share Posted June 9, 2008 ^That man knows his stuff. I'd take that as fact personally. Plus, the JAM guidelines state this (albeit in a different way) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ecksjay Posted June 9, 2008 Share Posted June 9, 2008 JAM ones, yes, although from my experience it was on a Blitz Access, which are obviously different units.A wideband is the only way to know for sure what is going on. Either way, the pump alone wont flood the engine or pump too much fuel in, my only main point being they dont run full chatt 24/7, thats all i'm really trying to say. Some good info here either way, very useful for someone im sure. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
huwr Posted June 10, 2008 Author Share Posted June 10, 2008 Funny you should mention that. The Blitz units prefer stock fuelling too. I've tested several on various different turbos (CT9, Tong Turbo CT9 Hybrid, TD04, Blitz K1 and Blitz K24) inside the last year or so..Thanks for the views so far, the above is very handy as i'll be running a tong turbo off a blitz, looks like i've saved ££ for a fuel pump Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ecksjay Posted June 10, 2008 Share Posted June 10, 2008 The Blitz you had preferred a stock fuel pump, the one I had however, did not. It ran far better and with far more urgency with a larger pump than the stocker.The majority of K1-200V tuned Blitz Access ECU's are mapped for 2JZ Supra fuel pumps (if they're ever sold as a kit, thats the pump which ill be sold with it). This ofcourse varies though, they don't all have the same tune, as i'm sure you know.Very interesting stuff. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
briggers Posted June 10, 2008 Share Posted June 10, 2008 im baffled you guys know a lot more than me but saying that i work in a bank lol wish i was on par with you guys Quote Link to post Share on other sites
huwr Posted June 12, 2008 Author Share Posted June 12, 2008 Gerards white EP82 is fuelling well with the Blitz ECU teamed up with an early Tong CT9 hybrid. Made 200 bhp on it's first outing then we messed around with an intake tract to increase the torque. The main piece of advice is not to boost it until you get a wideband on and see what's happening. Even cautious boosting can kill an engine under the wrong circumstances so be patient. Keep us posted on your progress,JayWhat sort of air/fuel ratios should I aim for for safe power? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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