Silverstone Yesterday, Damaged Engine - Help!

[Taggy]

At Trax yesterday (Silverstone) i pushed the starlet a bit to hard and I have damaged the bottom end. Was getting carried away trying to get past an EVO and didnt notice my car was right in the red on the thermostat guauge and also some other tell tale signs that it was time to ease off!!

I initially noticed a slightly different noise coming from the car when reved hard to around 6600rpm, this happend for about 5 mins, then on my last lap at the chequered flag came out i noticed a distincy metallic sound slowing down kinda like it going zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

I thought oh shit looked down and noticed the temp guague was as hot as you can get it!! there is no bloody warning light on the stock one so totally missed it, came off any how and looks like i caught it just in time, its not knocking bad, but its obvious somthing is wrong.

I listened underneath and it sounds like its coming from the sump area so somthing bottom end has had it. Car had spat about 200ml of oil out of my top breather also for some reason (i think i miss picked a gear at some point, so could have been that), car isnt smoking and has full power still.

Anyhow, question is this - I am good with the old spanner but never done a bottom end repair before, 1. Can i do it with the engine in, or is it an engine out job, 2. Are there any guides any where to help me repair it? 3. How much for the bearings and which ones should i change?

Any other advice would be great

Pain in the ass but i guess if im just using it on track shit like this is gonna happen, at least its at the end of the track season nearly lol!!

[Socks]

easiest option mate is new engine... easier and cheaper then, getting crank reground, all new bearings, running in etc...

it'll hav spun a shell as a guess mate...

might be worthwhile you getting some gauges with adjustable warning alarms.. for boost, oil pressure and water temp then u will be able to hear if a problem starts to occur when your concentrating on driving!

[Guest Enzo]

if the cranks fucked then your best off looking for a 4e bottom end

most people use this opetrunity to upgrade to 5e.

[Taggy]

Bah.. Im not keen on putting in a new lump, it took me ages to find the one that i put in it. There is so much crap on the net for sale that its pot luck if you can get your self a good one. I think the engine i have got is still in good nick as it was making about 189psi across the cylinders, It doesnt knock on idle and when you drive it slow, just when you start going over about 3000rpm it does, so im hoping its not suffered to much damage.

I havent got a clue what my next step to do is now, so need advice what should i do to properly inspect whats wrong first?

if the cranks fucked then your best off looking for a 4e bottom end

most people use this opetrunity to upgrade to 5e.

[Socks]

to change the bottom end your gonna hav to do as muchwork pretty much as changing the engine anyways...

alot of the pro engine builders wont warrant an engine with oversized shells...

and wen u get the crank reground u get rid of the hardened coating!

best bet is to find a 4e bottom end, which is where u will struggle! So you'll be after a new engine now!

ether that or go forged!

[durmz]

if ule be tracking it alot Ide get som gauge action with warning lights going on.

its a shame this has happened dude but its why ive resisted tracking mine yet, I know im a bit of a pussy lol

[Taggy]

Ahh this sucks, anoying thing is that i had a bottom end from my old engine but when i moved house recently I never thought i would need it so scrapped it, typical!

if ule be tracking it alot Ide get som gauge action with warning lights going on.

its a shame this has happened dude but its why ive resisted tracking mine yet, I know im a bit of a pussy lol

[james@cjperformance]

can you not just get a good second hand crank and bearings?i would whip the sump off to investigate further though before buying anything shame though as you have only just put it in

[GTnomez]

First port of call is to remove the engine and inspect it fully.

Then report back.

[Taggy]

yup you couldnt have put it better, no point crying about it, i could be lucky with minimal damage or it could be screwed, wont know till its out

Does anyone have any figures on prices for me to do a bottom end rebuild, im actually quite interested to do it, will probably be my winter project!

First port of call is to remove the engine and inspect it fully.

Then report back.

[Sparky]

1st thing i'd do is whip off the sump and see what you find in there, probably scored a bearing or two.

Shame mate, let us know how you get on.

[Guest Enzo]

ok worse case sinario your looking at between 250 - 400

for rebuilding the bottom end dependant on what machine shop you decide to use.

this price will include inspecting the crank and boars aswell as a honing of the bores and notching of the block if you intend on going 5e

any parts like bearings/shells are usualy extra.

would you be rebuilding with standard parts or are you going to go 5e?

[Rob]

Hey bud just seen what ya have put, i would not be happy my self.

I know you dont want to drop a new block in but if you do change your mind i would look on GTBITZ.COM.

The guy that owns gtbitz is a top bloke.

i know he sells 4efte's with out any aux and with.

if you call him on his number there and say rob said to call you he should do you a deal.

I would not recomend him if i did not trust him, i do as i have got a few bits of him myself

[Starlet__SR]

Hey bud just seen what ya have put, i would not be happy my self.

I know you dont want to drop a new block in but if you do change your mind i would look on GTBITZ.COM.

The guy that owns gtbitz is a top bloke.

i know he sells 4efte's with out any aux and with.

if you call him on his number there and say rob said to call you he should do you a deal.

I would not recomend him if i did not trust him, i do as i have got a few bits of him myself

He also overcharges for everything he sells. It'd be cheaper to rebuild his current setup rather than buy off that bloke.

Damien

[Rob]

He also overcharges for everything he sells. It'd be cheaper to rebuild his current setup rather than buy off that bloke.

Damien

thats why i said give him a call

[Rob]

i wish lol, just trying to help out thats all

[shorty]

Rebuild is easy enough to do, bit of engineering depending on damage, but you may be lucky and get away with polishing the crank, most likley will be a regrind and 100 odd quid on new bearings, chemical clean block and head for like 60quid and off ya go, will need a new hg etc as well but depends how big a rebuild you want, could go forged with full arp bottom end and arp headbolts, bigger hg and cams etc ;-) like i say depends how far you want to go, just inspect everything as nothigs worse than a rebuild when you miss somthing and it goes again.

[Taggy]

So whats the deal with people mentioning 5e setups and this is a good oportunity, looked into it and what benefits does this bring?

Why is 5e more preferable over 4e?

Rebuild is easy enough to do, bit of engineering depending on damage, but you may be lucky and get away with polishing the crank, most likley will be a regrind and 100 odd quid on new bearings, chemical clean block and head for like 60quid and off ya go, will need a new hg etc as well but depends how big a rebuild you want, could go forged with full arp bottom end and arp headbolts, bigger hg and cams etc ;-) like i say depends how far you want to go, just inspect everything as nothigs worse than a rebuild when you miss somthing and it goes again.

[Asad]

200cc extra capaciy enhances off boost driveability, torque? and spools the turbo up faster....no other difference

[shorty]

before you get to carried away though the 5e isnt as rev happy as the 4e from what I've read up on tgtt's 5e upgrade guide, plus for track surley you want a free reving engine? dont forget also bigger pistons more cc, i run 75.5mm in a 4e wich makes it damn near a 1400 (1371 or 1381 i forget wich) if your going 5e may aswell forge it wich means you have all the same costs as a forged 4e plus the extra £400-500 odd for a 5e to even start the build, plus a different fly so you can use 4e performance clutches, every one says use it as an excuse to go 5e but people forget its not far off the£800+ mark compared to = spec 4e lol build what suits your purpose mate, no need for ott builds as you will never see the returns when the time to sell eventualy dawns. little bit of lag keeps things fun

[Russleh]

i had to do a total bottom end rebuild which included everything. costs are roughly as follows

spare fucked bottom end - 30

decent crank - 100

all bearings and thrust washers - bout 100ish i think

block honed- 36

oem piston rings - 90

oem headgasket - cant remember

oem headbolts - 55

used pistons as mine were knackered - 50

then uv got all your fluids to replace from taking the engine out and oil filters to buy for the running in of the new one . maybe worth changin oil pump at this point aswell or at least the seals for it.

if u you do decide to do the 4e rebuild i have a spare block and crank here.

[glanzav.tee]

very sad to hear this myn has done the same but its melted or blown away some of my piston and i was not even in boost at the time just got louder as if its hittin a valve and pumfff gone, but we both in same place i am thinking forged but im not sure yet just thinking yet

[chr15_7_t_]

Hey bud just seen what ya have put, i would not be happy my self.

I know you dont want to drop a new block in but if you do change your mind i would look on GTBITZ.COM.

The guy that owns gtbitz is a top bloke.

i know he sells 4efte's with out any aux and with.

if you call him on his number there and say rob said to call you he should do you a deal.

I would not recomend him if i did not trust him, i do as i have got a few bits of him myself

i used gtbitz before and a few wee bits got damaged in courier, this was the couriers fault as the had hit it with a forklift(not as bad as it sounds lol) but the guy a gtbitz was more than helpful with sending me parts that broke for free and gave me a small discount would easily use him again