After all that and a good few hours fighting with my car and wiggling things that I couldn't really get hold of.....had the font end up wheels off, cleaned everything! Eliminated everything......and then "wait for it PaulStarltSr" gave the exhaust a wiggle farther back and found the rubber hanger thing missing and some nice fresh marks where the hangers had been twatting into each other!!!! Just goes to show, as suggested.....try the obvious stuff first, don't just panic! Anyways....thanks for all the advice guys! And Paul.......you win!