kbond Posted November 5, 2015 Share Posted November 5, 2015 In the process of building a forged motor and would like to raise the limiter abit but what is my options on doing this, I will be refreshing the whole head with new uprated valve springs and currently running an emanage blue but I'm not so clued up on management so would like everyone's opinions reallyI don't want to go mad with it 8k topsCheers keiran Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AdamB Posted November 5, 2015 Share Posted November 5, 2015 8k will be fine Quote Link to post Share on other sites
RobSR Posted November 5, 2015 Share Posted November 5, 2015 8K is okay, but you won't be able to get to that with an Emanage blue. You will need at least an ultimate if you want to raise the standard limiter. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
kbond Posted November 6, 2015 Author Share Posted November 6, 2015 Ah ok, will a blue wiring harness plug into an ultimate? Or is there much wiring involved?I've heard of someone running an emanage blue and a plug and play before is that possible? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
5e colin Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 I've seen stock heads doing 7.800rpm so will be easy for a forged motor Quote Link to post Share on other sites
ttestarlet Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 I've had plug and play ecu like the blitz access before that reved to 8500. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AdamB Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 I wouldn't really go more than 8500rpm on a 4E without some billet main caps. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Mad Mike EP82 Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 I wouldn't really go more than 8500rpm on a 4E without some billet main caps. what are stock valve spring good for out of curiosity? Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AdamB Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 (edited) I'd probably say about the same 8500rpm, although old springs will be hard to judge without testing them. It's not likely very many people go to that sort of rev limit anyway because the volumetric efficiency drops off way before that anyway so no need to rev that high. You'd need an extremely good cylinder head (big valves, wild cams) as well as a large enough turbo to still produce power up that high. Just looked through some plots on the leaderboard, seems most tuners only go to like 7200-7400rpm, even on big turbos like the GT28, I wonder why? Some look like their cut off quite quickly and could maintain torque a little longer. Edited November 6, 2015 by AdamB Quote Link to post Share on other sites
daniel_g Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 Maybe just playing it safe, certain tuners in the starlet world already have a shady rep as it is.. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
5e colin Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 stock 4efte springs start floating around 7700rpm + - after that you could drop a valve Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AdamB Posted November 6, 2015 Share Posted November 6, 2015 (edited) Maybe just playing it safe, certain tuners in the starlet world already have a shady rep as it is.. Pretty much all the so called "starlet tuners" have had something said about them in one way or another lol. I don't tend to get involved as I haven't dealt with any of them really, would just be nice if one of them read this and could explain a logical/ technical reason behind it. stock 4efte springs start floating around 7700rpm + - after that you could drop a valve I'm doubtful of that Colin as I'm sure the P&P ECU's rasie to 8200-8500rpm? Correct me if I'm wrong, would seem silly for Mines, Jam, Blitz etc to raise limit if reliability like that was compromised. Edited November 6, 2015 by AdamB Quote Link to post Share on other sites
daniel_g Posted November 7, 2015 Share Posted November 7, 2015 Pretty much all the so called "starlet tuners" have had something said about them in one way or another lol. I don't tend to get involved as I haven't dealt with any of them really, would just be nice if one of them read this and could explain a logical/ technical reason behind it. I'm doubtful of that Colin as I'm sure the P&P ECU's rasie to 8200-8500rpm? Correct me if I'm wrong, would seem silly for Mines, Jam, Blitz etc to raise limit if reliability like that was compromised.Im with you on that, havent used any of those tuners myself (due to distance) but it would be good to hear from what the main tuners on hear have to say about it Why they generally keep the rev limit below the 8k mark, from what ive seen anyway, there may be a few cases where its higher..As for the P&P ECUs, i had a Mines, revved to something daft like 8.5K, but FTE valve springs are what 20years old now so id say they'd have sagged and running that high RPM on old FTE springs is sketchy at best.But cant see why a tuner wouldnt increase the revs right up when new uprated springs are used, unless solid buckets etc are needed? Or they are just being slightly cautious.Who knows. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Whitenoize Posted November 7, 2015 Share Posted November 7, 2015 (edited) Im with you on that, havent used any of those tuners myself (due to distance) but it would be good to hear from what the main tuners on hear have to say about it Why they generally keep the rev limit below the 8k mark, from what ive seen anyway, there may be a few cases where its higher..As for the P&P ECUs, i had a Mines, revved to something daft like 8.5K, but FTE valve springs are what 20years old now so id say they'd have sagged and running that high RPM on old FTE springs is sketchy at best.But cant see why a tuner wouldnt increase the revs right up when new uprated springs are used, unless solid buckets etc are needed? Or they are just being slightly cautious.Who knows. all the tuners hide because there is so many complaints about them not even any point in having half the traiders onhere when was the last time we had a gb or anything from them most of them do fa jd is about the best he's the only one that actually comes up with things for the members Edited November 7, 2015 by Whitenoize Quote Link to post Share on other sites
5e colin Posted November 7, 2015 Share Posted November 7, 2015 i can hear my spring starting to float at that rpm for sure and daniel my mines only ever did 8000rpm ( real rpm not speedo rpm ) Quote Link to post Share on other sites
AdamB Posted November 7, 2015 Share Posted November 7, 2015 Im with you on that, havent used any of those tuners myself (due to distance) but it would be good to hear from what the main tuners on hear have to say about it Why they generally keep the rev limit below the 8k mark, from what ive seen anyway, there may be a few cases where its higher..As for the P&P ECUs, i had a Mines, revved to something daft like 8.5K, but FTE valve springs are what 20years old now so id say they'd have sagged and running that high RPM on old FTE springs is sketchy at best.But cant see why a tuner wouldnt increase the revs right up when new uprated springs are used, unless solid buckets etc are needed? Or they are just being slightly cautious.Who knows.I agree, the valve springs aren't getting any younger that's for sure.Like I said previously, it's hard to fathom why these P&P's ecu's raise the limiter if there going to cause adverse affects which could lead to catastrophic engine damage/failure. i can hear my spring starting to float at that rpm for sure and daniel my mines only ever did 8000rpm ( real rpm not speedo rpm ) I doubt it's valve float you're getting mate, valve float occurs when the cam lobe is not in contact with the follower (or any other means of contacting the valve), yes it can happen when engine speed is increased but it comes in the form of a missfire or performance loss where the valve opening and closing periods are messed up. You're more likely to experience valve bounce, this happens when springs are old, tired, can't exert the same pressure etc. Either isn't good and can be fatal. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
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