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TF035 vs TD04 on a 5E

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Is anyone running a TF035 (6cm²) on a 5E?

I'm going to be building a forged 5E soon, aiming for in the region of 240-270ish bhp, not really chasing numbers just want a decent amount of usable power, I've heard of TF035's making 240-250 on 4E's and of course the old tried and tested TD04 is capable of 270 odd.
240-250bhp would probably be "enough" and I'm thinking a TF035 on a 5E would be nice and responsive with plenty of usable mid range power, just concerned about it being choked at the top end.

I already have a TF035 6cm² which I originally bought for my unforged 4E but I'm going down the forged 5E route a lot sooner than expected, so wondering if I should forget the TF035 now and go straight to a TD04, I am thinking of trying the TF035 as I can easily change it for a TD04 afterwards but thought I'd ask if anyone else has done the same first.
 

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Posted (edited)
23 hours ago, ste91 said:

Is anyone running a TF035 (6cm²) on a 5E?

I'm going to be building a forged 5E soon, aiming for in the region of 240-270ish bhp, not really chasing numbers just want a decent amount of usable power, I've heard of TF035's making 240-250 on 4E's and of course the old tried and tested TD04 is capable of 270 odd.
240-250bhp would probably be "enough" and I'm thinking a TF035 on a 5E would be nice and responsive with plenty of usable mid range power, just concerned about it being choked at the top end.

I already have a TF035 6cm² which I originally bought for my unforged 4E but I'm going down the forged 5E route a lot sooner than expected, so wondering if I should forget the TF035 now and go straight to a TD04, I am thinking of trying the TF035 as I can easily change it for a TD04 afterwards but thought I'd ask if anyone else has done the same first.
 

I've not got first hand experience of the 5e but it seems that from the info I've read the TD04l is the minimum size most use for a 5e of that hp target.

If your going for the 270 hp end of it you may even need a Hybrid TD04l as it will be pushing the limits of the stock TD (Heat, choke etc).

The TF will most likely be out of puff before reaching the target hp as you thought.

TD's are cheap enough to buy one and test the potential and atleast you'll have one if you need to hybrid it or just sell it on anyway!

Edited by Claymore

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Posted (edited)

having personally run a td04l on a 5e, i'd say go with that, it was a great daily drive...lots of response and torque for the stock rev limit (7200 rpm). you get spool early 2000/2500rpm, decent boost by 3000/4000rpm...and tapers off around 5500/6500 rpm in time for the limiter to kick in....it feels like a much improved monster version of the stock 4efte/ct9 set up

if you plan to rev to 8,000/9000 rpm on the forge 5e, then the stock td04l is not for you

based on the description of the tf035, i'd say the td04l is better suited to the 5e out of the two

Edited by gorganl2000

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Yeah I don't think I'll be revving it to 8000+ rpm haha

 

There is another turbo I'm considering but no one seems to have heard or know anything about it - Holset HE211W.

The turbine wheel dimensions are identical to a TD04L and the housings are interchangeable. Supposed to be capable of over 300bhp and fast spooling.
 

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Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, ste91 said:

Yeah I don't think I'll be revving it to 8000+ rpm haha

 

There is another turbo I'm considering but no one seems to have heard or know anything about it - Holset HE211W.

The turbine wheel dimensions are identical to a TD04L and the housings are interchangeable. Supposed to be capable of over 300bhp and fast spooling.
 

I was looking at the 211w as an alternative as well! The problem seems to be getting hold of a used example. They're pretty rare to find let alone at a cheap enough price to ignore the TD. 

If you fancy a custom manifold there's always the HE221w. Best left for the 300 hp plus builds though. 

Are you the one who is going to be different and take the plunge on a 211w...? Would be awesome to see the results. 

Edited by Claymore

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Posted (edited)

There were a few genuine HE211W's on ebay a few months back but they're all gone now, so probably stick with a TD04, at least you know what you're getting. I am interested to see what the HE211W is like compared to a TD04 on spool times though, as the turbine wheel dimensions are identical, it's supposedly just a modern update on the TD04.

Edited by ste91

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A td04 13t on a 5e is basically a ct9 on a 4e

Unless it's a hybrid td04 I would say it would be wasted on a forged build. Hybrid td04 will be about 290whp

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6 hours ago, mycars12 said:

A td04 13t on a 5e is basically a ct9 on a 4e

Unless it's a hybrid td04 I would say it would be wasted on a forged build. Hybrid td04 will be about 290whp

it depends on what the owners want from the car...the stock td04l/5e can make decent power for a daily and have a nice power band...can start with the cheap tdo4l and always upgrade later on if required

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^ you're right, I'm not chasing power figures, I wanted a 5E for the extra cc for more torque and quicker turbo spool to make it more usable on the road. Seen it so many times over the years people build these 300-400bhp cars with fully stripped interiors etc... then realise that it's awful to drive, a couple of weeks later they're breaking/selling it!

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On 9/2/2020 at 1:19 PM, ste91 said:

^ you're right, I'm not chasing power figures, I wanted a 5E for the extra cc for more torque and quicker turbo spool to make it more usable on the road. Seen it so many times over the years people build these 300-400bhp cars with fully stripped interiors etc... then realise that it's awful to drive, a couple of weeks later they're breaking/selling it!

https://www.toyotagtturbo.com/community/index.php?threads/goldenvtr-how-it-began-deffo-not-56k-friendly.2902/

scroll about 2/3 down this page and look at the 2 dyno graphs --4efte/td04l and 5efte/tdo4l

Edited by gorganl2000

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After a bit of reading and looking at various dyno graphs I've decided to go for a  billet TD04, but with just a standard 13T sized wheel rather than a full hybrid.

The rest of the setup will be forged 5E bottom end, standard 4EFTE head, WEPR turbo kit, ME221 ECU, and all the usual supporting mods. The only thing I can see potentially holding it back now is the injectors as I originally thought I was keeping the original 4E on a TF035 so got a set of 370cc injectors which I've had cleaned and tested so I'm probably just going to use those, not sure if they're enough for a TD04 at 1.3-1.4 bar though?

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Nice chose. 

It really is a bargain of a turbo, and on a 5e it will spool fast. The combined torque out of that engine and turbo will be hard to beat on the road. 

You can get an 11 blade turbine wheel instead of the standard 12. This helps reduce back pressure holding the torque on after 5.5krpm and no delay in spool up. I'd strongly recommend it, or the 9blade that I'm running. 

I believe the billlet 7+7 compressor wheel helps with  mid to topend power over the standard 6+6 cast unit. 

The 11 blade billet I'm on hits hard on spool up (surge of power).

Will you be building it your self. Also have you got a build thread up. 

Edited by Sam44

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Not building the engine myself but will be fitting it and doing the rest of the work, haven't got a build thread I'd like to do one although I'm not sure if it's worth it when only a handful of people will ever read it, the forum is barely active at all compared to what it used to be back in the day.

I've spent the last couple of years just sorting out the chassis and now it's time for more power I was only intending to run a TF035 on the original 4E but that's on it's last legs hence the new engine, I've been collecting a few nice parts, WEPR turbo kit which I've had ceramic coated, ME221 ECU, 370cc injectors, new fuel pump and Aeromotive FPR, Wilwood big brake kit etc.. and the car is now quite well set up running BC coilovers, anti lift kit, front end fully polybushed and all ball joints and linkages replaced, the way it drives is a night and day difference from when I first bought it. Just needs some more power now so I'm hoping for a nice usable 250-275ish bhp.

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Sounds it, airomotive are the best. Sounds the kind of setup I'd dream of. 

If it helps I'm interested.

Edited by Sam44

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15 hours ago, ste91 said:

Not building the engine myself but will be fitting it and doing the rest of the work, haven't got a build thread I'd like to do one although I'm not sure if it's worth it when only a handful of people will ever read it, the forum is barely active at all compared to what it used to be back in the day.

I'd be interested as well, the more build threads on the forum the more activity hopefully. Not many 5e builds are being done recently.

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