Androo26 Posted October 5, 2015 Author Share Posted October 5, 2015 Something I noted looking at the Kinugawa Turbo site is the HP rating difference between their TF035 and their TD04 being 33 HP...... with the only difference being the Exhaust wheel sizes. With 5mm and 6mm being the differences in diameters..... so potentially I could be picking up some horse powers due to better turbine wheel flow...... we will see !! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Androo26 Posted October 15, 2015 Author Share Posted October 15, 2015 I was supposed to be on the dyno this afternoon testing this 4cm housed TF/TD hybrid ive been running.But due to circumstances beyond my control I wont be doing it now.So I will compare data logs instead. I have counted how many times it logged per 1000 rpm Starting at 2K and going to 6K.It logs at a set times per second, so im really kind of timing how long it takes to get from 2-3 . 3-4 , 4-5 and so on. Acceleration test.Ok so the 6cm exhaust housing was first and the 4cm one was next.2-3 3-4 4-5 5-6k ranges17 13 12 19 logs per one thousand RPM16 11 12 17Lets not look into the results too deeply as they arnt exactly scientific ... but the smaller 4cm housing wins in the mid range and going up hills at 110 on the freeway thats for sure. Both setups do pretty well in the 3-5K range. Great for drivabilityWhat will happen when a larger more free flowing TD04 turbine wheel is thrown into the mix. I hope to repeat this test using both 4 and 6cm housings too.My guess is 200-300rpm later spool up and more power everywhere due to the less back pressure on the motor. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Androo26 Posted October 15, 2015 Author Share Posted October 15, 2015 4CM TD04 is born !!!! It arrived back from GCG today. See how much it has been opened up to flow more The size difference between the TF and TD turbine wheels. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Androo26 Posted October 20, 2015 Author Share Posted October 20, 2015 Tommorrow Im removing the 4cm TF/TD hybrid to make way for the 4cm TD04 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Androo26 Posted October 21, 2015 Author Share Posted October 21, 2015 (edited) 4cm TD04 is on and been driven for the first time......... The first thing me notices, when giving it some shtick was that it hit boost cut almost imediatley wich was set at 14.9psi. Ok back the duty cycle down a couple of numbers from 65 to 63. 63 with the old turbine wheel would take boost out to 12 psi.... Still boost cut. I finally arrived at a stable 14 psi using 59 as the duty cycle number. Why did this happen and what does it mean. Well it makes more boost using the same amount of available exhaust gas...... I like to think of it as the larger turbine wheel is like a larger sail catching more breeze.( bigger suface area ) Also the larger diameter of the turbine wheel acts like a longer lever turning the compressor wheel, making greater use of the exhaust gas and being more efficient at utilising the heat energy. Less exhaust gas has to pass through the exhaust housing to drive the compressor to 14 psi. Less back pressure .... more power. I will try to get some data logs on spool up done tonight when its a bit cooler . bout 32 degrees outside now. Edited June 18, 2021 by Androo26 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Androo26 Posted October 21, 2015 Author Share Posted October 21, 2015 (edited) I managed to get a couple of boost logs but as I was about to do a few acceleration logs my laptop battery died. Any ways here is the info..... exact same test as previous foot to the floor from 2k, gain set at 98 , boost cut at 14.5 RPM BOOST2000 2 psi2120 3 psi2380 4 psi2560 5 psi2620 6 psi2880 8 psi3210 10 psi at this point the previuos turbo was at 14 psi already3320 11 psi3380 14 psi the boost builds so quickly at this point it doesnt even register 12, 13 psi It takes 260 RPM longer to reach the same boost. I can tell you that at 3500 its on like donkey kong and seems to have a fair bit more up top..... but im yet to log this... maybe ill get a chance tomorrow. From what i have read a stock TD04 will arive at this boost some 300 + - rpm later again. Edited October 21, 2015 by Androo26 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Androo26 Posted October 23, 2015 Author Share Posted October 23, 2015 I got a datalogged acceleration run in tonight and here are the results compared to the last turbo setup. RPM Range 4cm TF/TD 4cm TD042-3k 16 153-4k 11 114-5k 12 105-6k 15 15 Total logs 54 51 The lower amount of logs means the faster it went through that rev range. 4cm TD04 wins, Still good at 3-4 but even better at 4-5......I suspect wind drag comes into it at the 5-6 and it would take a fair bit more power to improve it here . More boost !!! Quote Link to post Share on other sites
5e colin Posted May 7, 2016 Share Posted May 7, 2016 any updates on this Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Androo26 Posted June 18, 2021 Author Share Posted June 18, 2021 (edited) Its been a long time , but ive got some further information to share. Since the last post Ive built a forged 1.3L 4E and still have the 4cm Turbine TD04L on board. This has made a best of 160.0 Kw at the wheels on 19 psi. Super fun to drive and traction is a problem even with a Quaife LSD. Long story short is im getting a bit more serious about lap times and also improving the efficiency of the turbo setup. So i decided to measure the turbine back pressure vs intake manifold pressure. Turns out its a bit high for my liking. 1.68:1 . Id much rather it around the 1.5:1 or less. Im going to get the original 6cm housing Ceramic coated and then swap it over essentially making it a stock TD04L again. I will re take the turbine back pressure measurement and get back to you guys with the findings. Still very much enjoying the Starlet life here in Australia. Edited July 3, 2021 by Androo26 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Claymore Posted June 18, 2021 Share Posted June 18, 2021 3 hours ago, Androo26 said: Its been a long time , but ive got some further information to share. Since the last post Ive built a forged 1.3L 4E and still have the 4cm Turbine TD04L on board. This has made a best of 160.0 Kw at the wheels on 19 psi. Super fun to drive and traction is a problem even with a Quaife LSD. Long story short is im getting a bit more serious about lap times and also improving the efficiency of the turbo setup. So i decided to measure the turbine back pressure vs intake manifold pressure. Turns out its a bit high for my liking. 1.9:1 . Id much rather it around the 1.5:1 or less. Im going to get the original 6cm housing Ceramic coated and then swap it over essentially making it a stock TD04L again. I will re take the turbine back pressure measurement and get back to you guys with the findings. Still very much enjoying the Starlet life here in Australia. Nice to hear mate, is the AU starlet forum gone now? Can't seem to find it anymore. Your build thread on there was awesome. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Androo26 Posted June 19, 2021 Author Share Posted June 19, 2021 Yeah I think it is unfortunately, I had my entire build on there. Oh well I guess i can just share my stuff here instead. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Claymore Posted June 19, 2021 Share Posted June 19, 2021 Sounds good, you have a very interesting build. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Sam44 Posted June 20, 2021 Share Posted June 20, 2021 (edited) great build. and nice turbo setup. im going to do the same turbo on the 5e none forged paseo ive just got. only running it at 10psi. using big cams and intake + a large external waste gate. hoping for instant turbo spool with hard pull right till red line. using the turbo/cam/intake. to provide a rpm range full of torque. Edited June 20, 2021 by Sam44 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Patches Posted June 23, 2021 Share Posted June 23, 2021 On 6/19/2021 at 6:04 AM, Androo26 said: Yeah I think it is unfortunately, I had my entire build on there. Oh well I guess i can just share my stuff here instead. I'm not sure if you know about this but there is a site which archives the internet, you can still see your build there http://web.archive.org/web/20200425172457/http://austarletclub.com/index.php?/topic/19604-project-starlet-andrew/ Glad you've came to update this again, really interesting thread. I've got a TD04-13T but am looking to maybe go TF035 or hybrid of both for a better response. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Androo26 Posted June 24, 2021 Author Share Posted June 24, 2021 How good is that ! I never would have known. Thank you sir. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Androo26 Posted July 2, 2021 Author Share Posted July 2, 2021 Just a couple pics from last weekends turbine housing swap. With any luck I’ll be able to get som data logs done today . I also added a flex joint to the external gate recirculation pipe. Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Androo26 Posted July 3, 2021 Author Share Posted July 3, 2021 (edited) As promised ive got out and done some testing on the new setup with great results. Swapping over to the stock TD04 6cm rear housing has seen a big drop in turbine back pressure over the 4cm unit I had been using. 18.75% reduction in back pressure. From 32psi down to 26psi Making the ratio now 1.33:1 as before it was 1.68:1 (Intake manifold saw 19-19.5psi) The difference in Boost/ RPM is as follows 4cm housing 5psi at 2700 10psi at 3150 15psi at 3700 6cm.housing 5psi at 2850. 10psi at 3350. 15psi at 3800 As you can see it takes a little more RPM to reach the same boost levels. ( all of 200 rpm for 10 psi at most). So roughly 100-200 rpm later across the board. How does it drive ?? It is noticeable to drive between the 2. The 4 cm is a very fun setup and hits harder invoking wheel spin with ease The 6cm is more linear and smooth. To be honest i like it better and gets better traction, less shock loading on everything also. Whats next you say ?? Well Kinugawa make a TD04 that has a 9 blade turbine wheel as opposed to the stock ones having 12. Less back pressure again I would have thought. Option this with a billet compressor and or step it up to a 15T/19T. Im really not after any more power as it was tuned with the small housing and still made 160kw to the wheels but less back pressure will make for an overall more efficient setup. Im going to try get this on a dyno again if i can , see what the numbers are. Edited July 3, 2021 by Androo26 Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Androo26 Posted July 3, 2021 Author Share Posted July 3, 2021 I’ll just add my dyno graph here too . 4cm TDO4 19psi Quote Link to post Share on other sites
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.